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#svelte

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I've been trying different frontend JS frameworks in some of my projects, and I'm... not as impressed with Svelte as I thought I'd be.

I've heard constant praise for this framework, and it is technically impressive, but there's just so much magic. Svelte 5 uses built-in not-quite-functions called runes, like $state or $derived, to mark certain variables as reactive state. When something reactive is updated, components redraw; otherwise, they don't. And when they don't, it's often very hard to figure out why. Plus the usual problems of the Vue-style component files: components aren't first-class objects, you have to put them in their own files, there's no JSX, etc.

I've written a lot of React, and React hooks are magical too, but this seems worse. Does it just feel that way because I've taken the time to get used to how React does things?

Maybe I'd use Svelte again on a project with (ironically) less reactivity, but my chat app uses websockets and indexeddb and lots of event streams, and Svelte just keeps getting in the way.

I'm considering trying Mithril.js next, which is, philosophically, the exact opposite. Sounds like a breath of fresh air.

Replied in thread

@itamarst one of the nice things is that I was touching this just now because of a weird bug¹ with Svelte and a state management library I was using, that was only affecting integration testing but started affecting the app itself when I added a schema validation library². So I removed the state management library and now I can also get on writing those tests!

¹) I submitted a bug report like 3 weeks ago but no response so far
²) dependency hell is my least favorite part of working in js/ts. I remember this from when I was learning React

I am looking for work as a Front End Developer. My elevator pitch:

- Strong experience creating product & feature prototypes #Angular, #Svelte, and #React.

- Solid front end dev, especially in #Angular, with strong #HTML, #CSS, #JavaScript, & #Typescript. Worked large products for Walmart & J. B. Hunt.

- Great tech lead for projects, mentoring all levels of experience.

Feel free to reach out to me here or via my LinkedIn linkedin.com/in/leifwells

So I am getting over my problems with actually building things... I used #Svelte and #ProseMirror (technically TipTap as the wrapper) to build a very basic prototype of an Outliner editor. Just the "blocks of text that become editable when you click on them". It's a pure Alpha "does this even work" but well... it does.

First of many components of a modern tool for thought, demonstrated. (because it's ProseMirror, the blocks can contain defacto arbitrary HTML to express rich text...)

Continued thread

Another anecdote. We had an internal CRM app at work, built in 2021 with the backend / API / frontend architecture.

Nest on the backend. TypeORM broke several times, preventing smooth upgrade. Nest was stable enough though.

The frontend was built using #Svelte and Sapper. OK, Sapper was a beta at the time. Replaced with SvelteKit in 2022. We tried to migrate. Twice. Resources were limited: the app was useful to us, but not paying our salaries. Migration would taken *weeks.*

Reintro!

I'm Dylan, a #fullstack #webdev from the Midwest, US. I like working with #js and #svelte so much that I wrote a book about #sveltekit! I've also worked extensively with #php and #WordPress but try to avoid the latter if I can.

I spend my days in the terminals of various #Linux machines and tweaking my #Vim config. I automate my #homelab with #ansible. I write about web dev on my #blog.

I enjoy #pcgaming and will occasionally #shitpost and boost #memes so brace yourself.